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Ontology Summit 2014 session-13: Communique Draft Review - Thu 2014-04-10

  • Summit Theme: OntologySummit2014: "Big Data and Semantic Web Meet Applied Ontology"
  • Session Co-chairs & Communique Co-Lead Editors: Professor Michael Grüninger & Dr. LeoObrst (in absentia)

Reference:

  • See also proceedings of the 2014.04.03 Ontology Summit 2014: Synthesis-II session - ConferenceCall_2014_04_03

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Abstract

OntologySummit2014 Session-13: "OntologySummit2014_Communique: Draft Review"

This is our 9th Ontology Summit, a joint initiative by Ontolog, NIST, NCOR, NCBO, IAOA & NCO_NITRD with the support of our co-sponsors.

Since the beginnings of the Semantic Web, ontologies have played key roles in the design and deployment of new semantic technologies. Yet over the years, the level of collaboration between the Semantic Web and Applied Ontology communities has been much less than expected. Within Big Data applications, ontologies appear to have had little impact.

This year's Ontology Summit is an opportunity for building bridges between the Semantic Web, Linked Data, Big Data, and Applied Ontology communities. On the one hand, the Semantic Web, Linked Data, and Big Data communities can bring a wide array of real problems (such as performance and scalability challenges and the variety problem in Big Data) and technologies (automated reasoning tools) that can make use of ontologies. On the other hand, the Applied Ontology community can bring a large body of common reusable content (ontologies) and ontological analysis techniques. Identifying and overcoming ontology engineering bottlenecks is critical for all communities.

Ontology Summit 2014 will pose and address the primary challenges in these areas of interaction among the different communities. The Summit activities will bring together insights and methods from these different communities, synthesize new insights, and disseminate knowledge across field boundaries.

At the Launch Event on 16 Jan 2014, the organizing team has provided an overview of the program, and how we will be framing the discourse - namely, to pursue that along four different content tracks that address different aspects of the issue at hand.

In today's session, our Lead Editors will be presenting, for the first time, a working draft of the OntologySummit2014_Communique for review and discussion. We will not be wordsmithing yet (that will be part of next week's agenda), but will be doing a higher level review, to make sure we have included everything we want to see in the Communique, and will attempt to expose and close all gaps.

More details about this Ontology Summit is available at: OntologySummit2014 (homepage for this summit)

Agenda

OntologySummit2014 - Panel Session-13

  • Session Format: this is a virtual session conducted over an augmented conference call
  • 1. Opening (MichaelGruninger, LeoObrst) ... [ draft communique ]
  • 2. Presentation of first draft of the communique (co-lead editors: Michael Grüninger, LeoObrst)
  • 3. Review by section and open discussion ... please refer to process above
    • Review and discussion will be at a higher level to ensure we have capture all of the material. In particular.
      • The section related to Barriers and Bottlenecks has been particularly challenging due to the wide range of topics that have arisen from the Track C discussions. One of the objectives will be to develop a clearer picture of the ideas that we want to cover in this section.
      • also, the section on Recommendations still needs to be written, and this will be a major point for discussion.
      • ...
  • 5. Summary/wrap-up/announcements

Proceedings

Please refer to the above

IM Chat Transcript captured during the session

see raw transcript here.

(for better clarity, the version below is a re-organized and lightly edited chat-transcript.)

Participants are welcome to make light edits to their own contributions as they see fit.

-- begin in-session chat-transcript --

Chat transcript from room: summit_20140410

2014-04-10 GMT-08:00 [PDT]

[9:20] Peter P. Yim: Welcome to the

Ontology Summit 2014 session-13: Communique Draft Review - Thu 2014-04-10

Summit Theme: Ontology Summit 2014: "Big Data and Semantic Web Meet Applied Ontology"

Session Topic: Session Topic: OntologySummit2014_Communique: Draft Review and Discussion

Session Co-chairs & Communique Co-Lead Editors: Professor Michael Grüninger and Dr. Leo Obrst

Agenda:

  • 2. Presentation of first draft of the communique (co-lead editors: Michael Grüninger, LeoObrst)
    • snapshot of working draft before this Communique Draft Review session -

http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/work/OntologySummit2014/OntologySummit2014_Communique/wip/OntologySummit2014CommuniqueDraft_snapshot_20140410-0845.pdf

  • 3. Review by section and open discussion
    • Review and discussion will be at a higher level to ensure we have capture all of the material. In particular.
      • The section related to Barriers and Bottlenecks has been particularly challenging due to the wide range of topics that have arisen from the Track C discussions.

One of the objectives will be to develop a clearer picture of the ideas that we want to cover in this section.

      • also, the section on Recommendations still needs to be written, and this will be a major point for discussion.
      • ...
  • 5. Summary/wrap-up/announcements

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Attendees: Alex Shkotin, Amanda Vizedom, Andrea Westerinen, Anne Thessen, Bart Gajderowicz,

Bobbin Teegarden, Carol Bean, Christoph Lange, Dennis Pierson, Ed Bernot, Henson Graves, Lamar Henderson,

Les Morgan, Matthew West, Megan Katsumi, Michael Grüninger, Mike Bennett, Mike Dean, Nancy Wiegand,

Peter P. Yim, Ram D. Sriram, Rex Brooks, Steve Ray, Sunday Ojo, Terry Longstreth, Todd Pehle, Todd Schneider,

Torsten Hahmann, Uri Shani,

Proceedings

[9:29] Michael Grüninger: Agenda:

1. Overview of Communique rough draft

2. Discuss Bottlenecks and Barriers section

3. Identify any missing material or ideas that need to be emphasized

4. Discuss recommendations

5. Action Items

[9:28] Alex Shkotin: Hi All!

[9:31] AmandaVizedom1 morphed into Amanda Vizedom

[9:33] anonymous morphed into Lamar Henderson

[9:36] Peter P. Yim: == Michael Grüninger starts session on behalf of the co-chairs ... see prepared

material under: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ConferenceCall_2014_04_10#nid4C1E

[9:40] anonymous morphed into Les Morgan

[9:40] anonymous morphed into Megan Katsumi

[9:43] ... Anne Thessen: Sorry I'm late

[10:04] Michael Grüninger: the draft on google-doc is at:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1n_28fM0GpEkp9Y_y1dUmHbCY0phjiF-1S8wrz32EtfQ/edit?usp=sharing ...

it is configured so anyone who has the link can view and comment

[9:45] Amanda Vizedom: If you want leave a comment on the Google Doc, it is helpful if you can make

it non-anonymous so that editors can come back to you for clarification. To become non-anonymous: At

top right of page, to left of "Comments" button, there is a little chat icon. Click that (it will

say something like "join chat" on hover-over). It will pop open a chat window, which you can

minimize. The main consequences will be that any comment you leave now will be attributed to you,

and also that other participants will see your name & icon (instead of anonymous) in the pull-down

list of viewers.

[9:58] Steve Ray: @Peter, @Amanda: A logistics question. I tried to add a comment, but the pop-up

says I don't have permission to add comments. Any ideas how to change that?

[9:59] Amanda Vizedom: @Steve: Michael said he'd changed it to "Anyone with the link can comment," so

I don't know why it would do that.

[10:12] Steve Ray: Mystery solved on the comments addition. I was also logged in on another tab with

a different account. Once I logged out of that account, it worked.

[10:14] Alex Shkotin: @SteveRay, I do not have different account but "You do not have permission to

add comments." :-( ... [(subsequent comment) you might want make sure you have already signed into

the google work environment with your gmail (or gmail associated) account first. =ppy]

[9:34] Ed Bernot: Please note the typo "reasoner on a small ontologies" in section 1.

[9:45] Todd Schneider: Some description of 'reuse' needs to be included.

[9:45] Andrea Westerinen: Track A tried to define what reuse is... Should that discussion be included?

[9:45] Andrea Westerinen: @ToddSchneider [9:45] Yes, that is my question as well.

[9:46] Todd Schneider: Well, at least the different ways ontologies could be reused.

[9:47] Todd Schneider: As example, an ontology may not be able to be reused 'directly', but the fact

the certain notions are represented or the way they're represented.

[9:48] Steve Ray: I think Section 2.1.2 should include the notion of "acceptance by the community".

That is, "I found this random ontology on the web - how does it rate in the eyes of the ontology community?"

[9:49] ... anonymous morphed into Bobbin Teegarden

[9:49] Andrea Westerinen: Also, a lot of time was spent on defining the conditions for reuse and best

practices. The current best practices is a bit behind the synthesis page. I think that Mike Bennett

updated recently (Wednesday?).

[10:02] Mike Bennett: Re @Andrea [0:49] I added two sentences in Wednesday. Will review.

[9:51] Peter P. Yim: == Q & A and Open Discussion ...

[9:53] ... anonymous morphed into Lamar Henderson

[9:52] Peter P. Yim: @ALL contributors - e.g. re. @AndreaWesterinen [9:49] ... it would be great if you

have made a major update to the wiki, to draw people's attention to it on the [ontology-summit] list

to notify everyone (especially the editors)

[9:55] Peter P. Yim: Further to the Peter P. Yim [9:52] comment ... @ALL contributors, the best place to get

the editors attention would probably be making a comment on the google-doc working draft of the

Communique ... please do that

[9:57] Christoph Lange: Re @PeterYim [9:55] one can also force comments to be sent as emails to some

people by including +email@addre.ss in the comment

[9:54] Amanda Vizedom: IMHO, one of the barriers to reuse is the state of tools (lack of mature (or

any) tools to facilitate use of the ontology features and processes that create reusability and/or

support evaluation for reuse.

[9:50] Henson Graves: On the face of it, it seems that section 3 (use) should precede section 2

(reuse)

[9:54] Steve Ray: @Henson: It is true that when Michael introduced the sections, he started

with "What ontologies are out there" (Section 3), and then "How to use them" (Section 2).

I can see either ordering working.

[9:56] Henson Graves: I like the "what are out there, how to use them,and potential places where they

could be used to come before the more detailed resuse, tools, etc

[10:00] Mike Bennett: I'm having connection issues, but just to say that re-use has been considered

more broadly than just getting an ontology and using it. We need to review and make sure that's

clear, as it certianly was to us

[10:00] Matthew West: [I found I did not have permission to add comments (... subsequently fixed)] so

just to say that when you do decide to create yet another ontology, that you are adding to the list

of ontologies others may need to integrate with, adding to the work of those that come after you,

even if it reduces work for you.

[10:00] Mike Bennett: We included re-use by inspiration (ref. ToddSchneider's verbal comment) in the

Hackathon

[10:00] Terry Longstreth: Doesn't reuse imply usage beyond the required applicability of the ontology?

[10:01] Todd Schneider: Terry, yes.

[10:01] Mike Bennett: @Terry certainly. That's a major factor since the requirements for a given use

case are narrower than being able to re-use it elsewhere.

[10:05] Andrea Westerinen: @MikeBennett [10:01] I will include in comments and Mike indicated that he

would pull them.

[10:01] Ram D. Sriram: Todd Schneider brought up an important issue on the semantics of Reuse

[10:05] Terry Longstreth: Then, perhaps the essence of reuse is the unanticipated application of an

ontology in an unexpected way or to an unforeseen purpose. For example, using a formal (OWL, CL ...)

ontology to instruct a programming staff.

[10:15] Andrea Westerinen: @TerryLongstreth [10:05] Unexpected use MAY result from reuse, but does

not have to. Reusing an event ODP would not be unexpected.

[10:22] Terry Longstreth: I was going to say that 'Use' specifies an intended purpose -that satisfies

some requirement(s)- while reuse suggests anything beyond requirements. The conundrum is how to deal

with the requirement that "X shall be reusable", but that's equivalent to the old systems

engineering shibboleth that a product "shall be user friendly."

[10:22] Andrea Westerinen: @TerryLongstreth Can you look at the reuse definition on Track A's

synthesis page? The first 2 paragraphs of the Synthesis deal with the definition. And, I just

updated it to reflect the conversation in this call.

[10:23] Terry Longstreth: @Andrea - I'll look at it

[10:05] Ram D. Sriram: I think the recommendations section should probably say something useful that the

reader can take away with. We should provide some answers -- based on the presentations in the

tracks -- to the questions posed in this section.

[10:07] ... Ram D. Sriram: Need to go out for 30mins. Will be back at 1:30pm

[10:09] Henson Graves: agree with 3.1 first

[10:10] Christoph Lange: Suggestion was: put 3.1 "What Ontologies are Needed?" (or, in other words

why ontologies?") before "reuse

[10:12] Christoph Lange: Regarding "what did section 3 miss from the Track B synthesis": I forgot

to _say_ it, but I scattered a few more such comments over the document. Over sections _other_ than 3.

[10:14] Mike Bennett: One issue with tools for me (relating to re-use and beyond) is the abscence of

tools at the level of a "system" design of a group of ontologies and the relationships (imports)

among them.

[10:17] Christoph Lange: @TorstenHahmann @MichaelGruninger I'm currently looking up whether/where

Till Mossakowski mentioned visualization in Track B

[10:18] Christoph Lange: @ChristophLange [10:17] See Till Mossakowski slide 17 and 18 on visualizing

ontology module imports and other links

- http://ontolog.cim3.net/file/work/OntologySummit2014/2014-01-30_OntologySummit2014_Using-Ontology-Tools-Services-Techniques-1/OntologySummit2014_Scaling-Tools--Experiences-with-Hets-n-OntoHub--TillMossakowski_20140130.pdf

[10:21] Torsten Hahmann: visualization is mentioned quite frequently in the track B summary:

http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OntologySummit2014_Ontology_Tools_Services_Techniques_Synthesis

... Partiuclar examples mentioned are OntoIOp and the Open Semantic Framework

[10:25] Henson Graves: second Michael's comment on need to discuss reuse and other issues in context of big data.

[10:26] Andrea Westerinen: Michel Dumontier talked about reuse and big data.

[10:26] Andrea Westerinen: Michel's talk was during Track A's second session.

[10:26] Mike Bennett: [I think my sound must be one way at the moment. Anyway,] I think on re-use

there are issue around what the ontology was created for versus what it's used for, which I think

goes beyond simply whether the creator thought about Big Data and Linked Data contexts. For example,

the levels of abstraction of the concepts may have been very specific to the creator's use case, and

it's not a criticism to say that they won't have had the budget / justification to think about the

broader meanings of the concepts in their ontologies - i.e. no reason they should think about the

re-usability of their ontology unless it's intended as an industry standard.

[10:28] Amanda Vizedom: FYI, I have been putting most of my comments in comments on the Google doc,

rather than here.

[10:28] Andrea Westerinen: @Steve Track A recommends examining the content to make sure that they

address their competency questions.

[10:29] ... Mike Bennett: @Amanda my bandwidth today is too narrow for me to contribute to the Google area.

[10:30] Andrea Westerinen: @Amanda [10:28] I will add later when I am not multi-tasking on the call

and chat. :-)

[10:30] Mike Bennett: We have barely scratched the surface in the area of re-use. We need to make

sure the Communique catalogues the questions that are out there.

[10:31] Terry Longstreth: @Andrea - from Synthesis Para 1 "The reuse may directly align with the

original intentions of the developers" -- I'd maintain that direct alignment should fall within the

intended use requirements. Finding the discontinuity between intended use and unintended reuse is

probably in NP.

[10:35] Andrea Westerinen: @TerryLongstreth [10:31] But reuse for the intended design is still reuse

... and builds trust in the original content.

[10:35] Andrea Westerinen: @TerryLongstreth [10:31] Just like reuse of software.

[10:35] Peter P. Yim: I still think we need to be more convincing to the Big data community, especially

those in data analytics which makes up the bulk of commercial applications now (than the one

paragraph under 3.1) ... Ontology can give them much more than that. ... [I looked through, say the

attendees in today's session, and I can't even be sure if we have any representation from that group

here ... which means we *really* have a gap to close (starting from grabbing their attention and

getting them interested).]

[10:34] Todd Schneider: For the challenge problems, what about the challenge of building/designing

ontologies for reuse?

[10:35] Mike Bennett: @Todd but does anyone want to design ontologies for re-use? Other than industry

standards ontologies, what cost justification is there?

[10:36] Andrea Westerinen: @Mike [10:35] Even ontologies defined for standards are usually specific-to-purpose.

[10:41] Mike Bennett: @Andrea +1 and sometimes too much so. (my detailed response here got eaten)

[10:36] Sunday Ojo: Reusability is constrained by semantic compatibility of the intended use

application domain and the unintended reuse application domain

[10:37] Andrea Westerinen: @SundayOjo [10:36] +1. Track A's synthesis tries to say this. If it can be

made better, please let us know.

[10:39] Bart Gajderowicz: Regarding finding ontologies on crowd sourced websites like stackoverflow,

the purpose is also for experimentation, not just design or implementation. Analogous to software

engineering, ontologies fall somewhere between software and data. To ensure a copy/pasted algorithm

does what you want, you run it against some input values and compare the output to what was

expected. With data you run queries in a more structured environment (think SQL). I think ontologies

work in the same way. We currently have a set of tools that we can use to quickly verify an ontology

against some set of queries. The gap exists in helping engineers identify and create the queries

they need to ensure an ontology is right for them.

[10:41] Bart Gajderowicz: The main benefit of this is that it allows engineers to experiment before

committing to a more in depth analysis and verification.

[10:46] Peter P. Yim: === Michael Grüninger: soliciting input - if you have one "recommendation" what

would it be - please enter into chat or verbally say it

[10:46] Andrea Westerinen: Standard, searchable metadata

[10:46] Todd Schneider: Documentation of ontologies: Assumptions, requirements, scope, intent, ....

[10:47] Mike Bennett: Recommendations: Metadata: include details of intended use case of ontology.

[10:48] Mike Bennett: Recommendation: Tooling: model driven, top down tooling with TBox and ABox

level visualisation, need to exist.

[10:48] Torsten Hahmann: my #1 recommendation: tools all the way down, including for designing,

publishing, finding, understanding, visualizing, verifying, maintaining, translating, integrating

ontologies on the web

[10:50] Bart Gajderowicz: Adding to @TorstenHahmann's point regarding tools, tools for

experimentation with ontologies on the web, to promote reuse.

[10:47] Steve Ray: Suggestion for recommendation: You don't need to jump in the deep end of the pool

to use ontologies. "A little semantics goes a long way" Try it.

[10:49] Christoph Lange: @SteveRay [10:47] I think somewhere in the Track C (?) synthesis (from

OscarCorcho's talk IIRC) I saw a reference to the importance of noting down a commonly agreed-upon

vocabulary in whatever tool, even Excel, and that capturing such information is more important than

first discussing what ontology engineering methodology to use

[10:50] Steve Ray: @Christoph: Agreed.

[10:50] Peter P. Yim: +1 to earlier discussed recommendation (verbal: Vizedom-Gruninger-Yim) that there

needs to have better communication/dialog/collaboration at the community level

[10:51] Peter P. Yim: @ALL: Please mark your calendars and reserve this same time for the next Thursday,

when we will, hopefully, be finalizing the OntologySummit2014_Communique, after the editors have

incorporated all the input from this session into that document - ref. developing details at:

http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ConferenceCall_2014_04_17 and

http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OntologySummit2014_Communique/Draft

[10:51] Ed Bernot: Thanks all. Good session!

[10:52] Peter P. Yim: @ALL: as announced by our Symposium co-chairs, Dr. Ram Sriram & Professor Tim Finin

our Apr 28~29 Symposium (at NSF in Greater Washington DC) is now open for registration. Please

register yourself ASAP, as capacity is limited - see OntologySummit2014_Symposium details at:

http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OntologySummit2014_Symposium ... Register for the Symposium

NOW, if you haven't already! - see:

http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?OntologySummit2014/WorkshopRegistration

[10:52] Peter P. Yim: -- session ended: 10:49am PDT --

-- end of in-session chat-transcript --

  • Further Question & Remarks - please post them to the [ ontology-summit ] listserv
    • all subscribers to the previous summit discussion, and all who responded to today's call will automatically be subscribed to the [ ontology-summit ] listserv
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    • (in case you aren't already a member) you may also want to join the ONTOLOG community and be subscribed to the [ ontolog-forum ] listserv, when general ontology-related topics (not specific to this year's Summit theme) are discussed. Please refer to Ontolog membership details at: http://ontolog.cim3.net/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?WikiHomePage#nid1J
      • kindly email <peter.yim@cim3.com> if you have any question.

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