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Ontology Summit 2011: Virtual Session-7 - "Perspectives from the European Commission" - Thu 2011_03_17     (1)

Summit Theme: OntologySummit2011: Making the Case for Ontology     (1A)

Session Theme: Perspective from the European Commission     (1B)

Session Chair: Dr. Nicola Guarino (ISTC-CNR)     (1C)

Invited Speakers: Dr. M��rta Nagy-Rothengass & Dr. Stefano Bertolo (INFSO-DG, European Commission)     (1D)

Title: "Thoughts without content are empty, intuitions without concepts are blind but you must set priorities and budgets for what you want to look at (with an eye to the EU's Digital Agenda and apologies to Kant)"     (1E)

Background     (1G)

OntologySummit2011 Theme: "Making the Case for Ontology"     (1G1)

  • Session Title: Perspective from the European Commission     (1G2)

This is our 6th Ontology Summit, a joint initiative by NIST, Ontolog, NCOR, NCBO, IAOA & NCO_NITRD. The theme adopted for this Ontology Summit is: "Making the Case for Ontology."     (1G3)

This year's Ontology Summit seeks to address the need to provide concrete evidence of successful deployment of ontologies by examining several application domains for such examples, and in better articulating where different "strengths" of ontological representation are best applied. To support that, the summit also aims to classify the categories of applications where ontology has been, and could be, successfully applied; to identify distinct types of metrics that might be used in evaluating the return on investment in an ontology application (cost, capability, performance, etc.); to lay out some strategies for articulating a case for ontological applications; and to identify remaining challenges and roadblocks to a wider deployment of such applications that represent promising application areas and research challenges for the future. The findings of the summit will be documented in the form of a communiqu�� intended for public consumption.     (1G4)

The session has been organized and chaired by Nicola Guarino to bring us the perspective from the European Commission.     (1G5)

See developing details on this Summit series of events at: OntologySummit2011 (home page for this summit)     (1G6)

Abstract     (1H)

Title: "Thoughts without content are empty, intuitions without concepts are blind but you must set priorities and budgets for what you want to look at (with an eye to the EU's Digital Agenda and apologies to Kant).     (1H1)

The explosive growth of linked data on the web has dramatically upended the knowledge representation landscape (at least as funding at the EU level is concerned). In Framework Programme 6 (2003-2008) much work was devoted on developing toolchains for sophisticated conceptual models but such models very seldom ended up being populated with a meaningful number of interesting instances, they were thoughts with much less content than had been expected. The situation has changed dramatically in the last two years: there are now on the semantic web hundreds of millions of entities with useful but minimal conceptual characterization attached to them, intuitions with very few concepts. The future points to a neo-Kantian synthesis, with expert ontologists developing conceptual models to provide a valuable layer of actionable intelligence on top of this growing mass of particulars. In this talk we will describe the broad objectives of the Digital Agenda for Europe the European Commission's top policy document for information and communication technologies. We will then explain why that policy makes certain knowledge representation domains more significant than others and what this might mean in terms of funding and cooperation opportunities.     (1H3)

Agenda     (1I)

Ontology Summit 2011 - Panel Session-8     (1I1)

  • Session Format: this is a virtual session conducted over an augmented conference call     (1I2)

Proceedings     (1J)

Please refer to the above     (1J1)

IM Chat Transcript captured during the session    (1J2)

see raw transcript here.     (1J2A)

(for better clarity, the version below is a re-organized and lightly edited chat-transcript.)     (1J2B)

Participants are welcome to make light edits to their own contributions as they see fit.     (1J2C)

-- begin in-session chat-transcript --     (1J2D)

Peter P. Yim: Welcome to the ...     (1J2E)

Ontology Summit 2011: Virtual Session-7 - "Perspectives from the European Commission" - Thu 2011_03_17     (1J2F)

Summit Theme: Ontology Summit 2011: Making the Case for Ontology     (1J2G)

Session Theme: Perspective from the European Commission     (1J2H)

Session Chair: Dr. Nicola Guarino (ISTC-CNR)     (1J2I)

Invited Speakers: Dr. Marta Nagy-Rothengass & Dr. Stefano Bertolo (INFSO-DG, European Commission)     (1J2J)

Title: "Thoughts without content are empty, intuitions without concepts are blind but you must set     (1J2K)

priorities and budgets for what you want to look at (with an eye to the EU's Digital Agenda and     (1J2L)

apologies to Kant).     (1J2M)

Please refer to details (dial-in, agenda, slides, etc.) on the session page at:     (1J2N)

anonymous morphed into Martin Gladwell     (1J2Q)

anonymous morphed into Nicola Guarino     (1J2R)

anonymous morphed into Rhett Moeller     (1J2S)

anonymous morphed into Sean Barker     (1J2U)

anonymous morphed into Duane Nickull     (1J2V)

anonymous1 morphed into Andreas Harth     (1J2W)

anonymous morphed into Denny Vrandecic     (1J2X)

Steve Ray: Cheat sheet: *2 = mute; *3 = unmute     (1J2Y)

Steve Ray: Good idea, Matthew     (1J2Z)

Frank Olken: Hi, this is FrankOlken. I have joined the call. I seem to be unable to edit the web page     (1J2AA)

(attendee list).     (1J2AB)

Steve Ray: Frank, please don't edit the wiki. Peter P. Yim is editing it. Since you are logged in to the     (1J2AC)

chat, Peter can see that you are present.     (1J2AD)

Peter P. Yim: @Frank - I have added you to the attendee list already (only one person should be editing     (1J2AE)

the wiki anyway) ... thanks for joining     (1J2AF)

Rhett Moeller: @Frank, have you tried clicking the Settings link in the main area of the window? Then     (1J2AG)

there's a field for you to type your name in.     (1J2AH)

anonymous morphed into Alden Dima     (1J2AI)

anonymous morphed into Pavithra Kenjige     (1J2AK)

MartaNagyRothengass presenting -> from slide#1 (recording time-point 0:01:19) on     (1J2AL)

Steve Ray: I would be interested to know the source of the funding numbers. Does this include private     (1J2AM)

investment or just government investment. My impression was that EU was outspending the US in     (1J2AN)

government investment.     (1J2AO)

Rex Brooks: As a SOA person in OASIS, I'm pleased to see "service' so prominent in this slide.     (1J2AP)

Rex Brooks: The difficulty with interoperability is the continuing corporate emphasis on some degree     (1J2AQ)

of proprietariness for maximizing profits. They have not gotten enough value yet.     (1J2AR)

Nicola Guarino: @RexBrooks: yes, but even without proprietary concerns still huge interoperability     (1J2AS)

problems remain. Interoperability has remained a priority for the EU for many years now, and still     (1J2AT)

we are far from achieving it     (1J2AU)

Rex Brooks: @Nicola: agreed!     (1J2AV)

Nicola Guarino: Marta's point on ensuring interoperability even in absence of standards is very     (1J2AW)

important from the ontology community point of view...     (1J2AX)

Steve Ray: Agreed. Ontologies will help with mapping among heterogeneous models of information.     (1J2AY)

Rex Brooks: @Nicola: Agreed again. I am building a couple of de facto use-based, user-defined     (1J2AZ)

ontologies for emergency management as an example for people to have terminologies they can use, and     (1J2AAA)

as a basis in the future for mapping other terminologies to these or other ontologies.     (1J2AAB)

Rhett Moeller: Steve / Nicola, that's where I get excited and really interested in this topic-- the     (1J2AAC)

ability to provide a consistent framework in spite of the differences between different lines of     (1J2AAD)

Steve Ray: @Rhett: Indeed. From a pragmatic perspective, we will never get everyone to stick to a     (1J2AAF)

single model of information important to them (often for good reason); therefore, mapping among     (1J2AAG)

models becomes the mechanism for interoperability.     (1J2AAH)

Denny Vrandecic: Yay to semantic wikis!     (1J2AAI)

Rex Brooks: Very surprised to see 3D objects and models. Excellent!     (1J2AAJ)

Nicola Guarino: @Rex: AIM@Shape was one of the most successful projects, in my opinion. Not much     (1J2AAK)

ontology there, but promising good stuff     (1J2AAL)

Rex Brooks: @Nicola:My surprise is due to the convergence of 3D and KM, especially with regard to     (1J2AAM)

CMS. You can show or visualize a higher density of information, especially as categories if you use     (1J2AAN)

3D constructs such as flippable pages we see now in iPad and XOOM as interfaces. You can get a much     (1J2AAO)

nigher density of material into a given screen.     (1J2AAP)

Nicola Guarino: @Marta (slide 1: despite EU efforts on promoting strong interdisciplinary     (1J2AAQ)

communities, still the ontology community in EU is a bit scattered, and many researches working on     (1J2AAR)

EU-funded projects involving ontologies are suspicious towards an open interdisciplinary approach     (1J2AAS)

(especially if this philosophy-oriented research on formal ontology).     (1J2AAT)

StefanoBertolo presenting -> from slide#35 (recording time-point 0:42:24) on     (1J2AAU)

Peter P. Yim: @StefanoBertolo - your slide numbering seems to be 1 (count) less than the shared deck,     (1J2AAV)

Peter P. Yim: ALL: please note, and try to add 1 to the slide number called out by Stefano Bertolo     (1J2AAW)

Steve Ray: Ah - good quote: "The need comes first, ontologies come later"     (1J2AAX)

Rhett Moeller: I like that-- strong design element.     (1J2AAY)

Rhett Moeller: Exposing what the user is *intending* to use is a huge thing.     (1J2AAZ)

Rhett Moeller: Why can't cable companies offer that?     (1J2AAAA)

Brand Niemann: Sounds like cloud computing to me!     (1J2AAAB)

Steve Ray: I think his point is this is cloud "data" as an analog to cloud "computing"     (1J2AAAC)

Brand Niemann: Every European Digital by their use of cloud computing tools!     (1J2AAAD)

anonymous morphed into Bobbin Teegarden     (1J2AAAE)

Peter P. Yim: @Stefano - we lost you ... can you call in again!     (1J2AAAI)

Rhett Moeller: I need to go anyway-- thank you for the fascinating introduction.     (1J2AAAJ)

Peter P. Yim: Nicola - is there some way to reach Marta or Stefano?     (1J2AAAK)

Nicola Guarino: The problem is that Stefano is not on the chat board...     (1J2AAAL)

Alden Dima: @peter - Is audio down?     (1J2AAAM)

Alan Rector: The sound seems just to have dropped out     (1J2AAAN)

Peter P. Yim: @Alden and All - Yes ... the speakers' line seems to be off     (1J2AAAO)

Nicola Guarino: I am trying to speak, but it doesn't work     (1J2AAAP)

Nicola Guarino: looks like a different call!     (1J2AAAR)

Rex Brooks: Yes, it sounds like our telecon line got crossed with another.     (1J2AAAS)

Steve Ray: I dialed back in, and unmuted. That worked. We have still lost the speakers though.     (1J2AAAV)

Rex Brooks: The speakers don't have a vnc connection, I believe.     (1J2AAAW)

Rex Brooks: This has been a terrific presentation so far. Very informative.     (1J2AAAX)

Denny Vrandecic: tweeting to stefano     (1J2AAAY)

Rex Brooks: I lost him on slide 58.     (1J2AAAZ)

Peter P. Yim: we're on slide#59 now - when Stefano calls out the number, please add 1 (the numbering on     (1J2AAAAA)

our deck and his differs by one)     (1J2AAAAB)

Steve Ray: Question for the speakers: In your opinion what do you find most compelling when proposers     (1J2AAAAC)

are "Making the case" for an ontology-based proposal? And what do you believe commercial     (1J2AAAAD)

stakeholders find most compelling? I imagine the answers to these two questions will be different.     (1J2AAAAE)

Rex Brooks: Marta's point on interoperability is key for me. What has been provided about the EU     (1J2AAAAF)

effort adds numerous powerful arguments especially about knowledge management and content management     (1J2AAAAG)

that should help make the case for interoperability for which ontology is essential.     (1J2AAAAH)

Nicola Guarino: @Stefano: the paradoxical aspect is that the ontologies used (and advocated for) by     (1J2AAAAI)

the linked data people have been becoming poorer and poorer while the Web of data was increasing...     (1J2AAAAJ)

Do linked data people feel the need of good ontologies?     (1J2AAAAK)

Rex Brooks: the Good Relations ontology is just a start. Could be exciting to see eCommerce take off.     (1J2AAAAL)

Nicola Guarino: @Stefano: Well, I would not insist on the fact that the Good Relations ontology helps     (1J2AAAAM)

to specify *exactly* the kinds of services offered... For instance, they don't distinguish clearly     (1J2AAAAN)

between goods and services... they mainly describe goods...     (1J2AAAAO)

Peter P. Yim: @Nicola & Stefano - I guess LOD folks still need "good ontologies" (by whatever label one     (1J2AAAAP)

calls them) ... ref LeoObrst's recent post responding to Dieter Fensel - see:     (1J2AAAAQ)

describe linked data are indeed needed ... and are "not quite available" yet     (1J2AAAAS)

Peter P. Yim: @StefanoBertolo - ref. your slides #70 & #71 - well said!     (1J2AAAAT)

Rex Brooks: @Stefano: Our Ontology Application Framework is not aimed at central focus of editor, but     (1J2AAAAU)

to the range of applications which can be amplified or made possible by the overall set of     (1J2AAAAV)

ontological resources, including editors.     (1J2AAAAW)

Rex Brooks: Excellent slides on Value Metrics, Models.     (1J2AAAAX)

Steve Ray: This is great input, although I fear Stefano has misunderstood Nicola's questions to be     (1J2AAAAY)

whether they are interested in projects with titles corresponding to our 5 tracks.     (1J2AAAAZ)

Rex Brooks: Volume, Value, Integration stories will definitely aid us in making the case for     (1J2AAAAAA)

Steve Ray: Slide 78 speaks to our core question.     (1J2AAAAAC)

Nicola Guarino: @Steve: yes, and it is more or less in agreement with the discussion we had so far.     (1J2AAAAAD)

Matthew, do you agree?     (1J2AAAAAE)

Matthew West: @Nicola: Yes I agree.     (1J2AAAAAF)

Rex Brooks: Excellent Presentation!     (1J2AAAAAG)

Peter P. Yim: @Marta & Stefano - bravo! Great Talk! ... simply awesome!     (1J2AAAAAH)

Nicola Guarino: @ALL: If you want to ask questions, please raise your hand     (1J2AAAAAI)

Nicola Guarino: The point on volume, value and integration is really new (as Rex underlined)     (1J2AAAAAJ)

Q&A and Open Discussion commences --> (recording time-point 1:44:02) on     (1J2AAAAAK)

Rex Brooks: In making the case for ontology, it seemed to me that the explosion of data, including     (1J2AAAAAL)

unstructured data in textual form, is a BIG argument in our favor, provided we offer real solutions     (1J2AAAAAM)

rather than explanations about ontology. Correct?     (1J2AAAAAN)

Stefano Bertolo: I would put my bet on "sensors" rather than "textual understanding"     (1J2AAAAAO)

Cory Casanave: And by "sensors" include all the transactional data in the world developed by existing     (1J2AAAAAP)

Christopher Spottiswoode: @Stefano: (My mic isn't getting thru...) Isn't there a quality problem     (1J2AAAAAS)

with those quantities of LOD triples? And ontologies should be able to address it.     (1J2AAAAAT)

Rex Brooks: Ahh, good points!     (1J2AAAAAU)

Christopher Spottiswoode: Masses of well-defined LOD from different sources tends to miss the     (1J2AAAAAV)

value-add from interrelationships in the T-box.     (1J2AAAAAW)

Steve Ray: Excellent session. Thanks very much.     (1J2AAAAAX)

Peter P. Yim: Yes ... great session!     (1J2AAAAAY)

Christopher Spottiswoode: Many thanks Stefano for your most articulate presentation!     (1J2AAAAAZ)

Peter P. Yim: -- session ended: 11:58 am PDT --     (1J2AAAAAAA)

-- end of in-session chat-transcript --     (1J2AAAAAAB)

  • Further Question & Remarks - please post them to the [ ontology-summit ] listserv     (1J2AAAAAAC)
    • all subscribers to the previous summit discussion, and all who responded to today's call will automatically be subscribed to the [ ontology-summit ] listserv     (1J2AAAAAAC1)
    • if you are already subscribed, post to <ontology-summit [at]>     (1J2AAAAAAC2)
    • (if you are not yet subscribed) you may subscribe yourself to the [ ontology-summit ] listserv, by sending a blank email to <ontology-summit-join [at]> from your subscribing email address, and then follow the instructions you receive back from the mailing list system.     (1J2AAAAAAC3)

Audio Recording of this Session     (1K)

Additional Resources     (1L)

For the record ...     (1L4)

How To Join (while the session is in progress)     (1M)

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