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RulesReasoningLP: mini-series session-02 - Thu 2013-10-31     (1)

Program: Ontology, Rules, and Logic Programming for Reasoning and Applications (RulesReasoningLP) mini-series of virtual panel sessions     (1A)

Topic: Concepts and Foundations of Rules and Ontologies: Logic Programs, Classical Logic, and Semantic Web - I     (1B)

Session Co-chairs: Dr. LeoObrst (Ontolog; MITRE) & Dr. HaroldBoley (RuleML; U of New Brunswick) ... intro slides     (1C)

Panelists / Briefings:     (1D)

  • Dr. HaroldBoley (University of New Brunswick; RuleML) - "From Data to Knowledge through Grailog Visualization" - slides     (1E)
  • Dr. BenjaminGrosof (Benjamin Grosof & Associates) - "Hilog, Defeasibility, and the Foundations of Practical Meta Knowledge: A Brief Introduction" - slides     (1F)
  • Professor GeorgGottlob (Oxford) - "Datalog+/- a Unifying Framework for Ontological Reasoning and Query-Answering" - slides     (1G)

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Attendees     (1J)

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Abstract     (1K)

Concepts and Foundations of Rules and Ontologies: Logic Programs, Classical Logic, and Semantic Web - I ... intro slides     (1K1)

This is the 2nd session of the RulesReasoningLP mini-series - a series of virtual panel sessions, and the associated online discourse, co-championed by some members of the Ontolog community who value the importance of the subject matter and would want to bring together those who are knowledgeable or interested into a dialog. The mini-series program will cover the topics that encapsulates the ontology-driven applications that will generally fall under "Ontology, Rules, and Logic Programming for Reasoning and Applications."     (1K2)

This session is the first of two sessions devoted to addressing the concepts and foundations of the technologies underlying ontology and rule reasoning, especially focused on logic programming and Semantic Web extensions. Panelists include Harold Boley (From Data to Knowledge through Grailog Visualization), Benjamin Grosof (Defeasibility and HILOG), Georg Gottlob (Extended Datalog and Ontological Reasoning), and ...     (1K3)

After the panelists briefings, there will be time for Q&A and an open discussion among the panel and all the participants.     (1K4)

See more details at: RulesReasoningLP (homepage for this mini-series)     (1K5)

Briefings     (1K6)

  • Dr. HaroldBoley (University of New Brunswick; RuleML) - "From Data to Knowledge through Grailog Visualization" - slides     (1K6A)
    • Abstract: Directed labeled graphs (DLGs) provide a good starting point for visual data & knowledge representation but cannot straightforwardly represent nested structures, non-binary relationships, and relation descriptions. These advanced features require encoded constructs with auxiliary nodes and relationships, which also need to be kept separate from straightforward constructs. Therefore, various extensions of DLGs have been proposed for data & knowledge representation, including graph partitionings (possibly interfaced as complex nodes), n-ary relationships as directed labeled hyperarcs, and (hyper)arc labels used as nodes of other (hyper)arcs. Meanwhile, a lot of AI / Semantic Web research and development on ontologies & rules has gone into extended logics for knowledge representation such as object (frame) logics, description logics, general modal logics, and higher-order logics. The talk demonstrates how data & knowledge representation with graphs and logics can be reconciled. It proceeds from simple to extended graphs for logics needed in AI and the Semantic Web. Along with its visual introduction, each graph construct is mapped to its corresponding symbolic logic construct. These graph-logic extensions constitute a systematics defined by orthogonal axes, which has led to the Grailog 1.0 language as part of the Web-rule industry standard RuleML 1.0.     (1K6A1)
  • Dr. BenjaminGrosof (Coherent Knowledge) - "Hilog, Defeasibility, and the Foundations of Practical Meta Knowledge: A Brief Introduction" - slides     (1K6B)
    • Abstract: ... We present the key foundations of meta knowledge in practical semantic technology for rules and ontologies, used most powerfully in Rulelog and Common Logic but also used to some extents in several other knowledge representation languages. We focus primarily on the hilog approach to higher-order syntax and the argumentation theory approach to defeasibility (prioritized conflict handling). We also touch upon other aspects including the rule identifiers approach to provenance info, reification (quoted formulas), and the restraint approach to bounded rationality.     (1K6B1)
  • Professor GeorgGottlob (Oxford) - "Datalog+/- a Unifying Framework for Ontological Reasoning and Query-Answering" - slides     (1K6C)
    • Abstract: ... Datalog+/- is a family of langues obtained by extending Datalog with existential quantification and "in rule heads, negative constraints, and equality in rule heads, while at the same time restricting the rule bodies so to achieve decidability and tractability. This talk will give a rudimentary introduction to the Datalog+/- family of languages. After a very brief introduction to the main language constructs, we will present decidable fragments and show how these capture disparate KR and DL formalisms such as the major DL_Lite fragments, extended versions of EL, UML diagrams over databases, F-Logic Lite, and SPARQL. We will also mention some first implementations of Datalog+/-.     (1K6C1)

Agenda     (1L)

RulesReasoningLP Mini-series Panel Session-02     (1L1)

Session Format: this is a virtual session conducted over an augmented conference call     (1L2)

Proceedings     (1M)

Please refer to the above     (1M1)

IM Chat Transcript captured during the session    (1M2)

see raw transcript here.     (1M2A)

(for better clarity, the version below is a re-organized and lightly edited chat-transcript.)     (1M2B)

Participants are welcome to make light edits to their own contributions as they see fit.     (1M2C)

-- begin in-session chat-transcript --     (1M2D)

Chat transcript from room: ontolog_20131031     (1M2E)

2013-10-31 GMT-08:00 [PDT]     (1M2F)

[9:12] Peter P. Yim: Welcome to the     (1M2G)

RulesReasoningLP: mini-series session-02 - Thu 2013-10-31     (1M2H)

Session Co-chairs: Dr. Leo Obrst (Ontolog; MITRE) & Dr. Harold Boley (RuleML; U of New Brunswick)     (1M2I)

Topic: Concepts and Foundations of Rules and Ontologies: Logic Programs, Classical Logic, and Semantic Web - I     (1M2J)

Panelists / Briefings:     (1M2K)

  • Dr. Benjamin Grosof (Benjamin Grosof & Associates) - "Hilog, Defeasibility, and the Foundations of Practical Meta Knowledge: A Brief Introduction"     (1M2M)

Logistics:     (1M2O)

  • (if you haven't already done so) please click on "settings" (top center) and morph from "anonymous" to your RealName     (1M2Q)
  • Mute control (phone keypad): *7 to un-mute ... *6 to mute     (1M2R)

(i.e. even if it says it is "offline," you should still be able to connect to it.)     (1M2U)

    • if you are using skype and the connection to "joinconference" is not holding up, try using (your favorite POTS or     (1M2V1)

VoIP line, etc.) either your phone, skype-out or google-voice and call the US dial-in number: +1 (206) 402-0100     (1M2W)

... when prompted enter Conference ID: 141184#     (1M2X)

Proceedings     (1M2AG)

[8:38] anonymous morphed into Conrad     (1M2AH)

[9:19] anonymous morphed into Brandon Whitehead     (1M2AI)

[9:27] Peter P. Yim: Hi everyone!     (1M2AJ)

[9:27] Peter P. Yim: Hi Alan Rector ... does the vnc access (with the local viewer) work for you now?     (1M2AK)

[9:29] Mike Dean morphed into Mike Dean     (1M2AL)

[9:30] anonymous morphed into Tara Athan     (1M2AM)

[9:31] Conrad morphed into Conrad Bock     (1M2AN)

[9:31] anonymous1 morphed into Georg Gottlob     (1M2AO)

[9:32] anonymous1 morphed into Bobbin Teegarden     (1M2AP)

[9:32] anonymous morphed into Francesca Quattri     (1M2AQ)

[9:36] anonymous morphed into Brian Haugh     (1M2AR)

[9:36] Peter P. Yim: == Leo Obrst and Harold Boley starts the session ... see slides     (1M2AS)

[9:38] anonymous morphed into Francesca Quattri     (1M2AU)

[9:40] Peter P. Yim: == Harold Boley presenting ...     (1M2AV)

[9:52] anonymous morphed into JuanSequeda     (1M2AX)

[10:05] Simon Spero: @HaroldBoley: has there been any user studies/ cognitive modelling of how easily     (1M2AY)

these graphical notations are understood (before training, after n-hours training, n-days/weeks after training?)     (1M2AZ)

[10:08] Mike Bennett: @Simon I could not help thinking of the guy from Australia who presented at the     (1M2AAA)

OMG in March about taking a more scientific approach to the graphics of modeling languages. Can't     (1M2AAB)

remember his name (anyone?)     (1M2AAC)

[10:12] ElieAbiLahoud: @MikeBennett: Dr Daniel Moody,     (1M2AAD)

[10:12] Mike Bennett: That's the guy! Ta.     (1M2AAF)

[10:12] Harold Boley: @SimonSpero, I didn't use parallel ('control') groups but sequential groups     (1M2AAG)

when teaching Semantic Web Techniques (, noticing     (1M2AAH)

that recent student groups understood Semantic Web Logics better and faster than earlier     (1M2AAI)

('pre-Grailog') groups attending this course (some with interdisciplinary background). Quantitative     (1M2AAJ)

studies should follow next, including colleagues from the Social Sciences. If you are interested,     (1M2AAK)

please do contact me.     (1M2AAL)

[10:21] Harold Boley: @MikeBennett, Yngve Lamo does 'typing homomorphism' (linked from     (1M2AAM)

[10:06] Leo Obrst: Harold, can you describe how a modal expression would be depicted in Grailog?     (1M2AAO)

I.e.,with necessity/possibility operators.     (1M2AAP)

[10:17] Harold Boley: @LeoObrst, modal expressions use complex nodes as shown in slides 104ff of the     (1M2AAQ)

[10:28] Mike Bennett: Thanks @Harold that looks very interesting.     (1M2AAS)

[10:03] Peter P. Yim: == Benjamin Grosof presenting ...     (1M2AAT)

[10:17] Peter P. Yim: [Grosof: note - typo on slide#4 ... Benjamin: please update, and I will swap it in.]     (1M2AAU)

[11:29] Peter P. Yim: re: [10:17] the Benjamin Grosof slide deck has now been updated ... Thank you, Benjamin     (1M2AAV)

[10:19] Harold Boley: @Benjamin, 'backquote' is visualized with the (snipangle) 'instantiation' boxes     (1M2AAW)

introduced of Grailog.     (1M2AAX)

[10:21] Simon Spero: The use of backtick threw me for a bit     (1M2AAY)

[10:21] Simon Spero: [Also, KR macros are awesome]     (1M2AAZ)

{{{ [10:24] Leo Obrst: Benjamin, do you have "contexts", i.e., for examples like "believes( john, ${ likes(mary,bob) } )" on slide 3? I.e., the truth value of the embedded argument is local? Or not? }}}     (1M2AAAA)

[10:30] Amanda Vizedom: +1 for Leo's question about contexts, or something (perhaps uses the "holds"     (1M2AAAB)

trick) that leverages all of this great support and enables modularizing reasoning, or defining     (1M2AAAC)

permitted paths of reasoning across contexts of various kinds, vs. non-permitted?     (1M2AAAD)

[10:48] Benjamin Grosof: Answer to Leo's question on contexts: the truth value of the embedded     (1M2AAAE)

argument is relative to the believer John, essentially.     (1M2AAAF)

[10:26] Amanda Vizedom: re: slide 6: Another (suggested but not stated) very important kind of     (1M2AAAG)

reasoning enabled by these KR tools: for federated data (including linked data) applications, not     (1M2AAAH)

only *having* provenance but *using* provenance to tailor how information from different sources is     (1M2AAAI)

treated... and being able to capture & expose rules about *that* in the ontology/knowledge base.     (1M2AAAJ)

[10:32] Amanda Vizedom: ... or defines 'contexts' in which rules, prioritizations, etc., apply?     (1M2AAAK)

[10:52] Benjamin Grosof: +1 to Amanda's comment about using provenance.     (1M2AAAL)

[10:34] Conrad Bock: Does well-founded LP fit in somewhere?     (1M2AAAM)

[10:50] Benjamin Grosof: Answer to Conrad's question: LP and its extension Rulelog discussed here is     (1M2AAAN)

under well founded semantics, cf. my survey presentation on 10/24/2013 Ontolog Forum session     (1M2AAAO)

[10:51] Benjamin Grosof: That's the semantics most frequently used due to good computational     (1M2AAAQ)

complexity and algorithmic characteristics.     (1M2AAAR)

[10:39] ElieAbiLahoud: Thank you Benjamin and Harold. I'am afraid I have to drop-off now.     (1M2AAAS)

[10:38] Peter P. Yim: == Georg Gottlob presenting ...     (1M2AAAT)

[11:05] Benjamin Grosof: wrt Georg's slide 30: note that stratified naf ("negation as failure") is a     (1M2AAAU)

special case of well founded semantics, and also a special case of stable semantics / answer set semantics.     (1M2AAAV)

[11:06] Leo Obrst: @Georg: on slide 9, is linear datalog related to linear logic?     (1M2AAAW)

[11:18] Georg Gottlob: @Leo: "linear" here is not related to linear logic; it just means only one     (1M2AAAX)

atom in rule bodies     (1M2AAAY)

[11:09] Peter P. Yim: === GiorgioOrsi (one of GeorgGottlob's postdocs) saying a few words about his     (1M2AAAZ)

implementation of Datalog+/- ... re. slide#37     (1M2AAAAA)

[11:11] Peter P. Yim: == Q&A and Open Discussion ...     (1M2AAAAB)

[11:09] Amanda Vizedom: @BenjaminGrosof: What tooling exists that implements / supports working with Hilog?     (1M2AAAAC)

[11:11] Benjamin Grosof: Answer to Amanda question about Hilog tooling:     (1M2AAAAD)

[11:11] Benjamin Grosof: A number of systems support restricted Hilog. E.g., Jena permits variables     (1M2AAAAE)

in predicate position.     (1M2AAAAF)

[11:12] Benjamin Grosof: The most sophisticated implementation is in Flora-2, used in Coherent     (1M2AAAAG)

Knowledge Systems software commercially now. (By most sophisticated: I mean both expressive and     (1M2AAAAH)

efficient. Coherent has a proprietary extension of Flora-2.)     (1M2AAAAI)

[11:37] Benjamin Grosof: More answer to Amanda Vizedom question about tools for Hilog: There are two     (1M2AAAAJ)

aspects: engine and UI. Engine techniques for handling functions come from Prolog (LP) and FOL.     (1M2AAAAK)

Unification is important. LP uses tries for indexing and "tabling" for efficiency/termination. State     (1M2AAAAL)

of the art on tabling is in XSB and Flora-2, then extended proprietarily wrt Hilog in Coherent     (1M2AAAAM)

Knowledge Systems software. Coherent also supports Hilog, esp. for textual logic (see Ontolog Forum     (1M2AAAAN)

particular features in its proprietary (but available) UI and so to an extent did the UI in the     (1M2AAAAP)

earlier Vulcan's SILK (code not available publicly, team disbanded).     (1M2AAAAQ)

[11:13] Alex Shkotin: Are there any use cases of usage of that languages in any domain areas?     (1M2AAAAR)

[11:19] Benjamin Grosof: Answer to Alex question: yes, there have been many usages of Hilog.     (1M2AAAAS)

[11:20] Alex Shkotin: @Benjamin, do you have a storage of Hilog ontologies. Just not to do twice:-)     (1M2AAAAT)

[11:28] Benjamin Grosof: Answer to Alex question on storage of Hilog ontologies: I don't understand the question.     (1M2AAAAU)

[11:29] Alex Shkotin: @Benjamin, like repository to download Hilog ontologies.     (1M2AAAAV)

[11:39] Alex Shkotin: I just have asked about Hilog ontologies repository as we have for OWL 2.     (1M2AAAAW)

[11:31] Simon Spero: @Benjamin: why SVN in 2013, instead of a Github repo?     (1M2AAAAY)

[11:24] Alex Shkotin: If we have some knowledge representation as text (for ex. on CNL) we can     (1M2AAAAZ)

compare different formal languages as a tools to use. For ex. we convert DB to CNL and then to OWL2:-)     (1M2AAAAAA)

[11:27] Alex Shkotin: So CNL representation of a knowledge may be most general against formal languages.     (1M2AAAAAB)

[11:35] Peter P. Yim: Join us again, same time next week (Thu 2013-11-07) for the OntologyBasedStandards mini-series     (1M2AAAAAC)

session-06 on "Ontology-based Financial Standards" co-championed by Mike Bennett, BillMcCarthy and ElieAbiLahoud     (1M2AAAAAD)

[11:36] Peter P. Yim / Leo Obrst: next in this series - 2013_11_21 - Thursday: RulesReasoningLP mini-series     (1M2AAAAAE)

session-03: Concepts and Foundations of Rules and Ontologies: Logic Programs, Classical Logic,     (1M2AAAAAF)

and Semantic Web - II - Co-chairs: Leo Obrst & Pascal Hitzler     (1M2AAAAAG)

[11:36] Leo Obrst: Thanks, All!     (1M2AAAAAH)

[11:37] Peter P. Yim: great session!     (1M2AAAAAI)

[11:37] Peter P. Yim: -- session ended: 11:36am PDT --     (1M2AAAAAL)

-- end of in-session chat-transcript --     (1M2AAAAAM)

Additional Resources     (1N)

For the record ...     (1N4)

How To Join (while the session is in progress)     (1O)

This page has been migrated from the OntologWiki - Click here for original page     (1O4)